24 Jan 2003 WSA F2F Minutes

See also: IRC log

Attendees

AT&T             Mark Jones
Carnegie-Mellon  Katia Sycara
Chevron-Texaco   Roger Cutler
Computer Assoc.  Igor Sedukhin 
Contivo          Dave Hollander
HP               Yin-Leng Husband
HP               Zulah Eckert
IBM              Heather Kreger
Iona             Eric Newcomer
Nokia            Mike Mahan
Oracle           Martin Chapman
Progress         Colleen Evans
SAP              Kevin Liu
See Beyond       Ugo Corda
Software AG      Mike Champion
Sun              Doug Bunting
Thomson          Hao He (remotely)
Tibco            Don Mullen
Toshiba          Frank McCabe
W. W. Grainger   Daniel Austin
W. W. Grainger   Tom Carroll
W3C              Hugo Haas
W3C              David Booth
Web Methods      Prasad Yendluri

Contents

• Agenda Items
• Summary of Action Items

<DaveH> http://www.w3.org/2002/ws/arch/2/issues/wsa-issues.html

<ericn-scr> Discussing issues list, see url above
... DaveO: At least define a framework for handling a priori knowledge issues
... DaveO: Proposes a glossary term or at least a property definition within the document
... ACTION: Include "a priori" in the glossary and revisit the issue
... ACTION: Hugo to ensure resolution of Issue 3
... ACTION: Don to talk with Dan to resolve issue 4
... DaveH: Ensure all issue resolution emails are copied to the wsa-issues list.
... DaveH: We have to follow policy about issue resolution in order to progress the spec drafts.
... Issue 5 remains unassigned.
... ACTION: Daniel to draft a response to Issue 6 to post to the group for review, if agreed Daniel will reply to the issue author
... ACTION: Daniel to research Issue 7 and respond
... Daniel to research and resolve Issues 8-12
... ACTION: Daniel to research and resolve issues 8-12
... ACTION: Hugo to respond to issue 13 (Link to issue broken)
... DaveH: Editors need to include WSDL harvesting info as per Issue 14
... DaveH: Issue 15, insufficient work yet, from Dave to ensure we review I18N WG docs
... ACTION: Martin to draft text to resolve Issue 17 and send it to the WG
... ACTION: MIke to resolve Issue 16
... ACTION: Daniel to resolve Issue 18
... ACTION: Hugo to resolve Issue 19
... ACTION: Mike to resolve Issue 20
... Note: the term "resolve" to identify individuals assigned to research and propose closure for an issue.
... ACTION: Eric to resolve Issue 21
... ACTION: Heather to resolve Issue 22
... ACTION: Daniel to resolve Issue 23
... ACTION: Chairs to invite P3P representative(s) to the plenary -- issue 24 unassigned
... Issue 25 unassigned
... ACTION: Hugo to add definition of "idempotent" to the glossary
... Issue 26 being addressed within DaveO's work on REST in general and may be resolved by that. Revisit once that work is further along

<DaveH> hugo, is there a way to get the action items from yesterday and wednesday?

<hugo> sure

<DaveH> I would like to review them this morning

<hugo> I didn't find any action items for Wednesday, but the minutes were not taken on IRC
... actions items from yesterday are:
... from http://www.w3.org/2003/01/24-ws-arch-irc.txt

Scribe: set down to work on the draft
... status of the usage scenraio document?

<hugo> actually, they are listed at: http://www.w3.org/2003/01/24-ws-arch-irc#T02-23-46

Scribe: focus on architecture itself
... working draft by end next f2f?
... proof of concept first?
... work on public mailing list?
... parallel working good, but risk of refactoring
... sulah
... work on architecture today

davidH: complete draft at end of next f2f

hesther: mtf

zulah: where should mgt end wrt Web services?

Heather: input welcome on other models

hugo: what is CIM?

heather: COmmon Information Model

<dbooth> Heather's presentation is available at http://www.w3.org/2003/ws/arch/3/01/heather/Management_f2f_012102_clean.htm . The slide images may not show up yet, but will shortly.

heather: waiting for Intermediary, Gateways

roger: issue wrt visiblitiy

hugo: cannot decide what to do about MTF

Scribe: how will mgt fit into WSA itself?

heather: finish requirements, continue work in OASIS Mgt Protocol TC

zulah: formj a liaison with OSAIS MPTC, OMG, etc?

davidh: try to manage fragmentation of competing mgt specs

zulah: recommend to fold MTF back into WSA?
... should MTF be done in a private group and then submit a proposal to the WSA group?

dbooth: collusion not welcome image
... could produce a w3c note on magement

zulah: recommend to disband MTF, solve problems in other ways (e.g. to produce a W3C note on mgt?

davidh: we are chartered to produce deliverables + report on consensus

<dbooth> From http://www.w3.org/Consortium/Process-20010719/groups.html#GAGeneral :
... [[
... A group may form task forces (composed of group participants) to carry out assignments for the group. The scope of these assignments must not exceed the scope of the group's charter. A group should document the process it uses to create task forces (e.g., each task force may have an informal "charter").
... ]]

heather: there are other models for mgt, e.g. those are relevant to telecoms such as SID

zulah: looking for ways for progressing mgt in the most effective way

<hugo> Note about Hugo's statement: concern that the MTF is touching things outside of our scope, which is limited to the architecture framework, and also about visibility

Scribe: action: heather will email deliverables relating to MTF to the WSA with due dates

<zulah> Note about Zulah's statements: The minutes should reflect that HP has participated in the MTF and is simply seeking reasonable solutions to resolve the issues that are impeding MTF progress. HP is also concerned that the spaces of telecom and enterprise management are somewhat disjoint and that whatever the architecture for management is, that it not favor one management model view of the world over another.
... Note about Zulah's statement: Further, that the MTF should maintain this neutrality when liaising with external standardsgrops.

heather: MTF formally does not recommend forming a new working group on mgt in WS at the moment

davidh: no recommendations until MTF produces requirements

<dbooth> Heather's presentation in PPT format: http://www.w3.org/2003/ws/arch/3/01/heather/Management_f2f_012102.ppt and in HTML format: http://www.w3.org/2003/ws/arch/3/01/heather/Management_f2f_012102_clean.htm

Scribe: call to roder
... call to order

<DaveH> ACTION: heather to post list of MTF deliverables to email

Scribe: what are the first principles of the WSA?
... Ch 1: Contract with teh reader
... intended audience
... framework for understanding
... concepts
... relationships
... scope
... constraints
... qualities
... what is an architecture
... ch 0 Preface
... why is this a good idea
... a web service is an example of a core concept
... ch 2 core concepts
... relationships such as "is a", "has a",
... part of contract: framework will provide structure necessary to derive benefits of the WSA.

<DaveH> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-archive/2003Jan/att-0073/01-SC00001L.pdf

Scribe: ch 3 qualities and attributes
... stakeholders' perspectives
... excpetions are a core concept
... key ilities: interopability, reliability, managability, extensibility, privacy, security, scalability, maintainability, adaptability
... action: eric draft the contract section
... action: katia and frank draft a sample concept/relationship
... WSA expresses deep appreciation for cyclone's hospitality for the f2f meeting

<MChapman> bye for the record

<DaveH> until next time

Summary of Action Items